Live from the State of the School Address
January 22nd, 2008 by Eagleionline Editorial Board
Eagleionline’s editorial board will be blogging live from EW120. We’ll post updates in the comments during the speech and Q&A session.
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The dean is in the room. He’s sporting what looks like a tan. As soon as tech is ready, we might begin.
12:27pm: Celebrities in the audience
Norah Wylie, Dean of Students
Tracey West, Assoc. Dean of Students
Liz Rosselot, Registrar
Henry Clay, Dean for Finance
Mike Cassidy, Dean of Faculty
12:29: Jesse Stellato presented Dean Garvey with a list of questions prepared by Eagleionline readers (replicated below):
Attendance: Standing room only - approximately 190 people.
Starting with strategic plan. 2 years ago, strategic plan was supposed to guide the law school until 2013. First time that law school has taken part in the University-level capital campaign of one billion. First goal was to increase the size of the faculty by 10 people (to 50 to 60 people) in 10 years.
Why did Dean Garvey focus on hiring business professors for the next year?
They’re looking to fill holes in tax and criminal procedure. Does that mean certain current professors are planning to retire?
Dean Garvey says there are an average of two departures per year. This year, the Law School has made offers to two business law experts, Brian Quinn and Amanda Rose, and Jenae Nelson, a property professor.
I like the theme that’s emerging: “It’s not perfect now but we’re making progress. Things are getting better and we’re moving in the right direction.”
The LLM program has had applications from 28 different countries.
Second goal is affordabilty initiative. In FY 2004, we gave out 80,000 in scholarship from annual fund. This year, BC has increased that amount by a factor of 10. Also, BC is increasing our amount of loan assistance. Thirdly, we’ve created a few new programs: 1) LLM. Last year we had applications from almost 30 countries.
Garvey was recently elected president from the American Academic of Law Schools (AALS). Lots of famous people held the spot before him, many of whom are associated with the top law schools.
Congratulations to Dean Garvey on his election. It’s really impressive: link
It’s impressive that we’re one of just a handful of schools to produce two presidents.
As President of the American Association of Law Schools, Dean Garvey has joined an elite group of scholars, including Karl Llewelyn, William Prosser, and the 12th chief justice Harlan Fiske Stone.
One goal of AALS this year, under Garvey’s leadership, will be to try to get Congress to pass a complicated federal act or amendment that will help students on the loan assistance front.
Someone should ask Garvey whether he is going to take 15 minutes to answer each question posed at the State of the School forum, as he has done in years past, in an effort to limit time available for challenging questions.
Just watch….you’ll see what I mean….
For our past coverage on alumni issues check out this page: link
On to the alumni front, Garvey is quoting statistics that lots of people want to be involved in the school.
The law school hired a consulting firm to survey alumni feelings. Among the findings were that only 43% still feel they’re part of the Boston College Law School community. Dean Garvey says the Alumni Development operation is addressing these concerns.
Stats about the alumni population from Garvey: 1) it is much larger that BC Law originally planned for, 2) alumni would like to be more involved, but 3) alumni felt neglected.
Quoting stats from a survey of contested methodology, no?
A large advantage of the LLM program is to spread the alumni population across the world. Is this advantage easily extended to career services?
Under the new plan, students will be members of the Alumni Association, beginning their second year.
Tomorrow, more ballots will be sent out to current alumni regarding the recently proposed changes. For Eagleionline’s coverage of that proposal, see the link by Austin, above.
Garvey stated that alumni are “the public face of the law school” and that “we need to keep our alumni informed about what’s going on.”
Now, on to Harris Connect - “a new online community for students.” Garvey has hired them to set up a “career advisor network.” This seems to be social network site…but for law schools.
Meet your new online community architect, Harris Connect.
Now Garvey is mentioning a few student successes: this year more than 50% of the students who applied to clerkships got them. Go BC!
BCLS Mass Bar pass rate was 96% for first time takers last year.
Hey Sleepy - Go ahead and doze off. Garvey will continue to talk about any combination of the following:
1. Capital campaigns
2. Consultants
3. Studies
4. National organizations/initiatives
5. Anything with numbers or statistics
This is the same shit he pulls every year. Either totally out of touch with what students care about, or else intentionally eating up time for otherwise valuable lines of discussion.
Phil A. Buster
Wow- the Dean only spoke for 17 minutes. Lots of time for questions.
Also we’ve gotten kudos from Princeton Review, we have a high bar passage rate, and our mock trial team has advanced to the Nationals. GO BC!
First question: Why did you feel that board members needed to be Dean-appointed?
Answer: Present structure not very democratic. This will be more democratic. Present structure is self perpetuating and new structure will be more representative. Problem is with structure, not incumbents.
Q: “Recent changes in the Alumni Council: Why was it necessary for the members to be Dean-appointed?”
Garvey: It’s not right to say that it was dean-appointed. The present alumni council is not elected - they run unopposed for their positions. The people that serve on the Council are generous and committed alumni. This new Council is more democratic. There will be a Board of Directors, all of whom will have portfolios and a lot of responsibilities. They will be elected by an assembly which will be comprised of alumni from across the country and all the classes and the student groups.
In a question about why the Dean felt it was necessary for the new alumni board positions to be Dean appointed Dean Garvey said that there is bad information out there about how the Alumni Council will be operated.
He believes that there will be a more democratic process involved in appointing board members.
He said the board positions will be elected by an assembly. The assembly will be comprised of all the chapters around the country.
He said it is necessary to strike the match to get it started. Therefore he asked a search committee to look for people who are willing to serve. They will recommend names to him and he will appoint them to the first council. From there it will be up and running.
Q: What positions is BC looking to fill
GARVEY: “We anticipate that all [new hires] will be tenure track.
Q: Will we replace existing professors, such as Prof. Howe?
GARVEY: “The short answers is that I am fairly confident that the answer is yes.”
Second question: New faculty: how many positions will be tenure-track? Looking to fill salary lines for people who have left or are retiring?
Answer: Anticipate that they are all tenure-track positions. Faculty hires are looking to expand salary lines. Provost has told Deans that Faculty across the University is looking to grow by as many as 100. Law School is looking for 10 of the 100, as an effort to get better.
Follow up: Concerned about distribution of subject matter. Only 1 family law class offered this semester. Will the new hires be in subject areas to address subject area deficiencies of departed faculty members?
Follow up:
Q: I’ve heard dissatisfaction about the distributions of classes offered (e.g. only one family law class). Will the new hires correct for that?
GARVEY: you can expect a certain amount of change in the distribution in new faculty
Survey on demand for business courses: 43% of students said they wanted to do business work, while 41% wanted to do litigation.
Btw, if you’ve just joined us now, we’re at the state of the school at boston college law school. We’re in East Wing 120, where there is a standing room only crowd.
Dean Cassidy: new faculty in criminal procedure is likely, as Bob Bloom is the only one holding it down after the departures of Profs. Goldfarb and Farley.
Q: how much weight are you going to give to diversity when making hiring decisions?
A: it’s a subject that i thought would come up, in light of prof. howe’s retirement and prof. farley going elsewhere.
Farley, Garvey noted, was moving due to family reasons, and he said that it was important not to misunderstand the data.
Garvey is stressing that it’s a subject of considerable importance to the faculty.
Q: “How much weight will you give by the stated desire of students to be taught by a diverse faculty?”
A: Unfortunate congruence of departures by Goldfarb and Farley. It’s hard to lose two minority faculty in one year, but don’t misinterpret the data. Six candidates interviewed this year, three were minorities. Faculty hiring has been between 35-40% minorities since Garvey came into office in 1999. If we continue to hire minorities at the same rate we have been doing, you can expect 8-10 new minority faculty. It’s very important to the faculty.
BC has made an offer to Professor Janai Nelson currently a Research Professor and a Fellow of the Ronald H. Brown Center for Civil Rights and Economic Development at St John’s University Law School.
Good answer on diversity hiring: The oldest professors are predominantly white. We are hiring minority professors at a 30-40% rate. As retirements occur we can expect a more diverse faculty. That’s called a plan and I like it.
Q: What are you ideas about being a Catholic law school? What does it mean for the institution?
A: Some have thought to drop the “Catholic” part of the phrase. I disagree. This makes us who we are? “We can find God in all things” Others have used the phrase not because it objects to us being Catholic, but because they think our ambitions should be broader. Garvey stated that “I would be happy next year just to be ranked the best Catholic Law school.” We are Catholic, but that’s not all we are.
“I would be happy next year just to be ranked as the best Catholic law school” because Georgetown in #14 so that’d be a big jump.
They ask the faculty not to separate their professional lives and personal lives (what people do in church and at home).
Q: Has there been anything done to address the concern of diversity on the law review, to move away from a solely grades-based system?
A: Yes. Conversations have been ongoing in the Law Review’s Publication Committee. We anticipate a report from that committee within a month and a half.
Law review question:
Has admin considered how to make Law Review more diverse? Considered moving away from a strict grade-on policy?
Garvey: Publications committee (headed by Prof Garcia) will report back on issue in a month or so.
Jesse asks question re: Rankings and Cassidy throws up a MS Word Doc on the projector. The lights go dim and we’re in presentation.
I just asked a questions about rankings. Garvey was ready! He’s switching to the powerpoint!
“STALL STALL STALL STALL STALL STALL STALL STALL STALL STALL STALL STALL STALL!
“JOHN, DONT LET STUDENTS ASK ANY MORE QUESTIONS!!!!!!!”
-Mike
On screen is ABA Annual Questionnaire (can we get a copy?). Garvey struggles w/ Word, figures it out w/ some help, and the crowd applauds.
Tuition has increased from $28,504 in 2002 to $36,590 in 2007. This is the only place where the more money you spend, the higher your ranking. Garvey: “so we’re doing our best to help you.” Laughter from the poverty-stricken crowd.
Seems likely that he’s just going to overlook remaining questions submitted by eaglei if no one brings them up…? (Feel free to infer that I’m saying I won’t bring it/them up.)
Duly noted, PAB. (I think I’ll have a question for you about that later.)
I think it’s safe to say that the Dean understands the rankings system.
Garvey won’t predict as to US News.
Garvey was in the Solicitor General’s Office between 1981 and 1984.
Garvey: Pats to beat Giants.
Questions from David about Alumni Resignations: Why was the process so acrimonious? Was there anything can could have been done better? Will the acrimony have any future effect on alumni relations?
GARVEY: “We’ll be having a meeting on Feb 25. regarding the alumni council” This meeting will be run by Marianne Lord, and students are invited. I can’t deny the fact that there are some people who thought that we should do things differently. “I won’t address the [state of mind] of the current alumni council, who think everything is just fine.”
LORD: There were 15 members on [a diverse] task force. They wrestled with the question “how can we massage the current council” in light of our goals. It became obvious that we were trying to “retrofit” a council that was designed for “discussion” with capabilities for “action.” Once this discussion unrolled, the committee realized they needed a new structure. “I think that the people who weren’t on the council never came to the conclusion” that these issues were discussed in great detail and at length. In the end, “people couldn’t come to grips with that change.”
Follow up by David: If it were just change, why did someone as distinguished and experienced as Prof. Howe resign?
David’s follow up also mentioned Prof Howe’s desire for diversity of opinion. LORD misinterpreted that to say that Prof Howe was desiring racial diversity on the new council and launched into a discussion of affinity alumni groups and their support for the structure. Diversity of opinion is NOT simply having people with diverse backgrounds supporting the new plan (which is important too), but they are two different types of diversity.
Question. Can you discuss our endowment?
GARVEY: That’s a wonderful question. When I came to BC it was 14, now it’s 28. The market has been pretty good, and that has certainly helped, but basically our annual giving since I became dean has tripled. When i came we raised 600,000/year. This year we raised 2,000,000. I expect to raise 5 million this year in pledges. With respect to our endowment, we have a long way to go. We’re still not were we ought to be. But we have made a lot of progress.
And the meeting was wrapped up at 1:38 p.m.
Why were the EagleiOnline editors harping over and over and over about the alumni council situation, particularly when time was of the essence? Surely there were more pressing concerns that affected students more conspicuously - including the lack of communication about releasing grades and the craptastic Exam Software we’re all subjected to…
Better yet, perhaps we should have an LSA State of the School address or Q&A so that the LSA “leaders” could address these issues on behalf of the student body.
2Legit, did you read the brief letter Eagleionline gave Dean Garvey before the meeting? Eagleionline did mention both grades and ExamSoft.
I agree with you, though, about the importance of having an LSA state of the school. Our LSA “leaders” don’t seem to do much except host bar reviews. Not that I don’t like bar reviews (i do) - i just feel like they should be more involved in student affairs and accountable for their decisions.
“Why were the EagleiOnline editors harping over and over and over about the alumni council situation, particularly when time was of the essence?”
Because that topic spikes EagleI’s traffic.
Actually, I asked the question regarding the alumni council resignations because I am graduating in four months and the events surrounding the resignations impact my decision to be involved with the school as an alumni.
Well done Dean Garvey. Bravo, bravo.
why didn’t anyone ask about course evals and why we don’t get them
I understand that what was said by the Dean in the one-hour meeting this afternoon was going to materially impact your personal decision to get involved as an alumni in the law school; I just think the unproportional amount of time spent on it could have been better spent at the upcoming meeting that is specifically designed to address alumni council concerns that students here at the law school have.
I just found it slightly grating that the number of questions asked by the Eaglei editors detracted from other concerns of the student body.
I am sorry if you found the discussion grating. I honestly feel that this is an extremely important issue that needs to be discussed in front of the student body. We will all be alumni. Also, my guess is that attendence for the meeting discussing the alumni resignations will be significantly less than the 190+ that showed up for the state of the school.
I was the only member of the Eaglei editorial board that asked a question about this issue, with one follow-up. The answers to my questions took a lot of time. Maybe that is what you found frustrating? I found this frustrating as well, because I don’t think the heart of my question was ever answered.
Dave, as a recent grad who’s been following the alumni council issues with some concern, I appreciate your efforts to get an answer out of Dean Garvey on this! I am mystified by the negative reaction of some people to your questions. After all, everyone at BCLS (including 2Legit) will be alumni for a lot longer than the three years we spend being students. Examsoft glitches and 2-week delays in grade reporting are the sort of thing nobody cares about after graduating. Rankings and alumni council problems, however, affect all of us long afterward!
Sure a second-year law student cannot be shortsighted enough to care more about the temporary displeasure of exam glitches and two week delays than the alumni council situation which will effect all of us for our entire careers?
If I know something about law students as a group, it’s that they’re not myopic.
To david and alumn ‘07 (who wasn’t there)
I don’t think it was so much that you asked a question about the alumni situation, it was that it was asked after several other people had asked about it already and it had been responded to, the topic had been moved away from, it was clear that another meeting was set up to discuss it, and time was running short on questions. It is an important issue. I just think people also had other things also on their minds and were frustrated with its dominance of the meeting.
David asked about the acrimony that has developed between many prominent alumni and Dean Garvey. This is (or should be) a very important issue to students, not only because we will all be alumni some day, but also because unhappy alumni don’t give to BC. And if alumni don’t give to BC, we all loose.
As I recall, the other question that had anything to do with the Alumni Council was focused not on the acrimony and the Dean’s plans for responding to that, but about the actual structure of the proposed council. This is an important issue for students as well, because the plan is (as we heard yesterday) to have 2Ls and 3Ls represented on the alumni council.
Having a strong alumni council will not increase revenue if the school continues to operate as a shitshow.
Further, unless and until BCLS breaks away from (read: has an independent bank account) BC main, the school’s funding will continue to suffer.
Finally, what if anything do Ellen’s comments contribute? Editors, please edit out my last sentence.
I recognize the importance of the alumni council issue - and I think “To David” summed it up well.
I’m not sure it’s too short-sited to question the competence of how exams are administered - it is a pretty big deal that apparently several people in one class couldn’t even access the exam from ExamSoft and were required to handwrite on that afternoon due to no fault of their own. One friend couldn’t finish the exam, while her classmates typed away and had time to review their answers.
Also, apparently a Tax exam was handed out from the Fall of 2005.
There are other examples (Corporations?). The fact is, those grades stay on their transcripts.
In one of my exams, the proctor actually let someone borrow his laptop because they couldn’t get examsoft to work, despite support getting there 30 minutes prior to the exam. I also proctored exams last year and examsoft can be an absolute mess.
when a number of other “top tier” law schools have abandoned it in favor of just having students use their usual word processing programs, and sign an honor code?
Are we really that less honorable or trustworthy than students at other institutions?
It would be interesting if a professor or administrator could comment on this. I find it striking, and rather disconcerting that a place like BC that prides itself on the integrity and mutually supportive environment of its students and faculty would still feel the need to use “anti-cheating” software such as this.
I agree - furthermore, schools ranked higher than us aren’t subject to that added stress on exam day (I believe UChicago, at least, uses MS Word).
Unofficial List of Schools Using Honor Code Exams (i.e. - no exam software, just MS Word)
American University
Boalt Hall
U of Chicago
Harvard
Stanford
U of Washington.
See http://www.maclawstudents.com/blog/law-school-exam-software/#schools)
Do you guys think it has anything to do with the fact that MS Word lets students save their answers, and therefore precludes professors from re-using their exams in future years? I know certain professors do re-use exams, and ExamSoft makes it easy for them to keep the exam a secret from future classes.
Note: I’m not suggesting this as justification, just a possible explanation.
But once again, we have to ask, since professors at law schools with honor codes and no secure software presumably have to deal with the same issue (and apparently deal with it successively) why can’t our faculty?
Prof Plater currently lets his students use Word to write their open book Property exam. He makes you sign an honor code stating you will not use the internet. He said he has never had a problem with violations. If it’s good enough for him, why not for everyone?
In accord with 1L who just posted about Plater’s exams: Plater does the same thing for his Envi Law class. And all the take-home exams that I know of do the same thing. Plater’s honor pledge includes ‘I will not keep a copy of this exam.’
Make exams open; make the penalty for improperly keeping, transmitting, or receiving an exam, and for cheating on an exam, expulsion (absolutely, no exceptions).
The 99% of us that are honest will be fine with it; the 1% that are not have such a huge amount to lose, that it’s not worth it.